Yeah only 2 generations ago, LGBT people were considered mentally ill. 4 generations ago women were considered unfit to vote. 8 generations ago about half the US though it was OK to own slaves. It takes a while for ideas to die out. That’s why US elections turn out the way they do.
Humanity isn’t progressing uniformly forward like this. Lgbtqia+ people were considered normal part of society by various cultures. Also Magnus Hirschfeld was an advocate for lgbtqia+ people a hundred years ago. Slavery has been transformed into modern slavery because the western world has found other, more concealed ways to force people into labor. Ideas may die out, but they will pop into people’s head again and again.
And yet discussing progress in this manner can be a confort. All that you said was true… But what the person you replied said was also true. Two generations since fertilizer or two generations since we locked in Malthusian anarchy[please note I do not espouse Malthusianism]. Three generations since the worst war known to man and three generations that did not experience that kind of war. Glass half full, glass half empty. It’s correct to question the myth of unstoppable progress thru which you can just kick your feet up and relax. But equally is it important to keep perspective remember that, yeah, eight generations ago chattel slavery was a bonafide institution and four generations women were unfranchised. Things get better and they get worse. We make progress and it is wiped away. We still keep trying.
The American people are pretty fickle. It won’t take long for them to become unhappy with the Republican party. Of course once that happens and you and I are celebrating “Yay! We got rid of the fascists!” they’ll be going “Hmm… These other guys are pretty uninspiring. Maybe we should try fascism again.”
* There’s a big asterisk here that this is all predicted on elections continuing unabated. Which is not a given.
And when the Democrats put up the same fascist policies in continuation of the status quo and refuse to defend those who find themselves targeted by Republicans, you will “hold your nose” to vote for them and cry at anyone who refuses to fall in line and do the same; in fact you will actively work against their efforts to build up power in resistance of both parties just because it won’t immediately pay off and you’re too brainwashed to believe in any power but the two-party system’s power. And then your party will lose anyways and take another step rightward in response. I know you people, we’ve done this whole song and dance before.
Sure, I prefer Kamala over Trump and MAGA, that is true. Obvious, even.
But I’m guessing my point is the one about to actually be meaningfully proven over the next few weeks or months.
Will you regret letting Trump in if he starts rounding up people on a large scale and committing human rights violations in their detention? Or will you not?
Voting was a strategy to prevent it. You seem like you didn’t participate.
You don’t need to tell me what you did, but did you do anything? Did you have to not vote in order to do what you did?
Will you be doing anything about it, or will you just be reveling in the prospect that voters who didn’t toe the line will be gravely punished for their disobedience? Cause I’ll be linking arms and struggling with my comrades to protect these people and win our rights back and then some regardless of how they voted. I’ll be building the resistance against the bigoted and blood-soaked leadership of this country, and you’ll be tearing it down cause it didn’t vote how you wanted.
The Democrats were running on the same exact policies wrt immigration, don’t act like they were going to save us. They would rather lose an election than say or do anything to upset their donors. The anti-democratic voter shaming propaganda that would allow the Democrats to hold power regardless of their actions or rhetoric, up to and including genocide; that allows them to smother candidates and third parties in the crib that could win voters from both parties if given the chance; that allows you to believe that your power to change things begins and ends at the voting booth; is far more responsible for the situation we find ourselves in than any MAGA voter. It takes two to fucking tango my friend.
Even where there is no prospect of achieving their election the workers must put up their own candidates to preserve their independence, to gauge their own strength and to bring their revolutionary position and party standpoint to public attention. They must not be led astray by the empty phrases of the democrats, who will maintain that the workers’ candidates will split the democratic party and offer the forces of reaction the chance of victory. All such talk means, in the final analysis, that the proletariat is to be swindled. The progress which the proletarian party will make by operating independently in this way is infinitely more important than the disadvantages resulting from the presence of a few reactionaries in the representative body. If the forces of democracy take decisive, terroristic action against the reaction from the very beginning, the reactionary influence in the election will already have been destroyed."
-Karl Marx and Frederick Engels, Address of the Central Committee to the Communist League
I voted for the PSL, and I have been struggling with them thereafter.
Yeah only 2 generations ago, LGBT people were considered mentally ill. 4 generations ago women were considered unfit to vote. 8 generations ago about half the US though it was OK to own slaves. It takes a while for ideas to die out. That’s why US elections turn out the way they do.
Humanity isn’t progressing uniformly forward like this. Lgbtqia+ people were considered normal part of society by various cultures. Also Magnus Hirschfeld was an advocate for lgbtqia+ people a hundred years ago. Slavery has been transformed into modern slavery because the western world has found other, more concealed ways to force people into labor. Ideas may die out, but they will pop into people’s head again and again.
And yet discussing progress in this manner can be a confort. All that you said was true… But what the person you replied said was also true. Two generations since fertilizer or two generations since we locked in Malthusian anarchy[please note I do not espouse Malthusianism]. Three generations since the worst war known to man and three generations that did not experience that kind of war. Glass half full, glass half empty. It’s correct to question the myth of unstoppable progress thru which you can just kick your feet up and relax. But equally is it important to keep perspective remember that, yeah, eight generations ago chattel slavery was a bonafide institution and four generations women were unfranchised. Things get better and they get worse. We make progress and it is wiped away. We still keep trying.
Two steps forward. One step back
two steps forward, random.randint(1,4) steps back.
Wonder how long it’ll take before we get to step forward again. As far as I’m seeing, we’re in for a long ride back. Not just for 4 years.
The American people are pretty fickle. It won’t take long for them to become unhappy with the Republican party. Of course once that happens and you and I are celebrating “Yay! We got rid of the fascists!” they’ll be going “Hmm… These other guys are pretty uninspiring. Maybe we should try fascism again.”
* There’s a big asterisk here that this is all predicted on elections continuing unabated. Which is not a given.
And when the Democrats put up the same fascist policies in continuation of the status quo and refuse to defend those who find themselves targeted by Republicans, you will “hold your nose” to vote for them and cry at anyone who refuses to fall in line and do the same; in fact you will actively work against their efforts to build up power in resistance of both parties just because it won’t immediately pay off and you’re too brainwashed to believe in any power but the two-party system’s power. And then your party will lose anyways and take another step rightward in response. I know you people, we’ve done this whole song and dance before.
I’m guessing you didn’t vote for Kamala.
Let’s see if we were wrong about Trump’s 2nd term being uniquely dangerous.
Thanks for proving my point.
Sure, I prefer Kamala over Trump and MAGA, that is true. Obvious, even.
But I’m guessing my point is the one about to actually be meaningfully proven over the next few weeks or months.
Will you regret letting Trump in if he starts rounding up people on a large scale and committing human rights violations in their detention? Or will you not?
Voting was a strategy to prevent it. You seem like you didn’t participate.
You don’t need to tell me what you did, but did you do anything? Did you have to not vote in order to do what you did?
Will you be doing anything about it, or will you just be reveling in the prospect that voters who didn’t toe the line will be gravely punished for their disobedience? Cause I’ll be linking arms and struggling with my comrades to protect these people and win our rights back and then some regardless of how they voted. I’ll be building the resistance against the bigoted and blood-soaked leadership of this country, and you’ll be tearing it down cause it didn’t vote how you wanted.
The Democrats were running on the same exact policies wrt immigration, don’t act like they were going to save us. They would rather lose an election than say or do anything to upset their donors. The anti-democratic voter shaming propaganda that would allow the Democrats to hold power regardless of their actions or rhetoric, up to and including genocide; that allows them to smother candidates and third parties in the crib that could win voters from both parties if given the chance; that allows you to believe that your power to change things begins and ends at the voting booth; is far more responsible for the situation we find ourselves in than any MAGA voter. It takes two to fucking tango my friend.
I voted for the PSL, and I have been struggling with them thereafter.
This has happened before. Even after Abu Ghraib Bush Jr won re-election. Even after Iran-Contra the Republicans won re-election.
But the fact is that they do not have the answers. They can only take things for themselves, and hope that people give up.
Civilian Drone Strike Obama and Palestinian Genocide Joe aren’t better
It wouldn’t surprise me if Trump made it President for life.
No way that would last long, it’s just not how Americans tick
I pray america doesn’t last his lifetime or that it dies with him