• BetaBlake@lemmy.world
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    16 hours ago

    Even without interference communism can never work, it’s not how human nature works, it relys on everyone being on the same page which will never happen

    • 小莱卡@lemmygrad.ml
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      4 hours ago

      do you realize that you are contradicting your statement? You talk of “human nature” as a law of nature, something that cannot be changed and has to conform every single time, but then you mention that people are just different lmao.

      • Dengalicious@lemmygrad.ml
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        4 hours ago

        People who talk of “human nature” are white supremacists. The idea is that groups and people with different cultures are not human is what underpins this whole concept

    • NSRXN@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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      7 hours ago

      it’s not how human nature works

      where is human nature defined?

      this is a thought-terminating cliche, not an my argument to be taken seriously

    • untorquer@lemmy.world
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      12 hours ago

      It’s in our genetics to engage in a perpetual exponential quarterly growth and make our decisions based on the benefit it brings to our investors. Any caveman could tell you that smh…

      E: my god it’s a hyperbolically absurd take in memes and even with the caveman comment I still need to /s apparently…

      • SabinStargem@lemmy.today
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        9 hours ago

        No, cavemen were very egalitarian. This is because back then, you couldn’t hoard much of anything - food spoils quickly, sex requires your partner to like you, and personal possessions were things like tools or the odd bit of clothing. It was when wealth could be preserved, such as livestock, stored grain, jewelry, and eventually coinage, that wealth became an hereditary thing.

        This is why a future economic system has to be designed to prevent the excessive hoarding of wealth. Not too little, nor too much. Humans weren’t evolved to be free of consequence, especially from each other.

      • Pilferjinx@lemmy.world
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        14 hours ago

        If you ran humanity in thousands of simulations how often would we end up in the same capitalistic situation?

        • 小莱卡@lemmygrad.ml
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          4 hours ago

          the majority would be relatively the same with minor variances on cultural customs and traditions, society conforms to law whether if you realize it or not, this is a chief principle of materialist philosophy, understanding that the things conform to definite laws and that we must and can discover them. Historical materialism is the materialist conception of history with the conclusion that the development of production is the chief driving force in the development of society, quantitative improvements in production lead to qualitative changes in how society is organized.

          With this in mind, Communism is a stage of development where developments in production led to a society of abundance that ended the exploitation of man by man. Communist states, like China, are not in that stage but are organized to pursue that goal, this is why China has a massive focus point on the development of productive industries.

        • Cowbee [he/they]@lemmy.ml
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          6 hours ago

          Very frequently, but it is exactly just as likely it would have moved on to Socialism and eventually Communism, or retained feudalism, it all depends on when in development.

        • Grapho@lemmy.ml
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          3 hours ago

          Far less often than we end up with communalist hunter gatherers and early agrarian communes and evidently for a much shorter time. Does that mean feudalism can never work? Capitalism is never at any point of productive development possible?

          If you’ve never studied an economics text (a real, materialist one, not fucking graphs with conveniently simple and clean cut rules that never seem to apply and zero statistics) then try not to speak so authoritatively on economics.

          • Pilferjinx@lemmy.world
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            8 hours ago

            Your words make no sense to me. If you want to convey ideas use the common tongue. It feels like you have some neat ideas though.

            Edit: Can anyone please decipher what this guy said?

            • NSRXN@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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              7 hours ago

              people share goods and culture naturally. the prevailing historical models are cooperative. anticooperative, competitive societies are rare.

        • untorquer@lemmy.world
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          13 hours ago

          So many it would be hard to count, at least 4 or 5. But numbers don’t really go much higher than that. Any caveman could tell you that.

        • Obi@sopuli.xyz
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          8 hours ago

          What an interesting question. I have no idea what the answer is, but the question is bloody great.

      • Spaniard@lemmy.world
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        13 hours ago

        No, but greed and envy is. That’s why humans have written so much in the last thousand years about greed and envy.

    • comfy@lemmy.ml
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      15 hours ago

      What part of communism relys on everyone being on the same page?

      • Grapho@lemmy.ml
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        12 hours ago

        It’s right there on Karl Marcos’ “All About Capital”, basic economics commie

    • melpomenesclevage@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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      16 hours ago

      capitalism, of course, where utility is only allowed to exist as the unexploited byproduct of a scam, cannot fail. it can only be failed.

    • m532@lemmygrad.ml
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      13 hours ago

      Haha no communism can force you to go against your evil “human nature” so you have to aid the collective people, who mostly have a good human nature

    • TheFogan@programming.dev
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      14 hours ago

      Kind of some level of any system isn’t it? In short if a system has a means to power that can tweak the rules. Inevitably will result in one group ceasing the rules, turning them to raise how much they can tweak them, and ensuring they continue to be tweaked in their favor.

      Communism relies on a possibly impossible starting point. Theoretically if the starting point were reached, it seems the most sustainable. Whether it’s possible to reach that starting point is the great mystery.

      • Cowbee [he/they]@lemmy.ml
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        6 hours ago

        What “possibly impossible starting point” does Communism rely on? This reads like someone that hasn’t actually attempted to engage with what Communists believe, to be honest.

      • quaternaut@lemmy.world
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        13 hours ago

        Yeah I think you hit the nail on the head here. It’s interesting to think about how even though communism could theoretically be the best system, it could mean nothing if we don’t know how to meet the conditions to achieve it in the first place.