Primaries during incumbent sessions are never serious for any party, so 2012 doesn’t really count.
They had a very long primary process in 2016, but Hillary won. Yes, the establishment wanted her, but she also won more primaries than Bernie by the time the convention came around, so the super delegates deciding not to overturn the will of the primary voters is hard to argue against, even though I preferred Bernie.
2020 had a primary season, and Biden won.
2024, they had an incumbent, and Biden didn’t drop out until like 2 weeks before the convention.
And there were down-ballot races in the primaries endo one of those years and more. Did you vote in all of them, or are you just bitching because the people who do get off their ass and participate don’t do what you want?
There were primaries every one of those years. There was no rigging of the primaries. If people had voted differently in them we’d had different candidates.
Once again, did you put in a minimal amount of effort to educate yourself on the candidates and participate, or did you just whine about it after the fact?
What about the other primary years when the important stuff is really decided? Biden, Obama, and Clinton didn’t just magically appear and become contenders to the Democratic primaries. They spent decades as party members, working their way up from the bottom. You think Bill Clinton would’ve been President if he hadn’t been Governor? You think he would’ve been Governor if he hadn’t been Attourney General? You think he wouldn’t have been Attourney General if he hadn’t previously run for the House?
There were primary elections every step of that path, and he won them all. That’s how he became Bill Clinton. And why did he win that first nomination?
He was a coordinator for the McGovern campaign and clerked for Senator Fullbright.
People don’t magically get nominated for the Presidency. It takes decades, and the people who will be nominees in the future are running for county clerk, state rep, or city council now. But if you only show up to vote in general elections every 2-4 years, or only vote in the Presidenial primaries, you don’t get to bitch about who gets selected because you wait 20 years to give your input on a candidate.
Take part in the process and give your input when and where it matters or stop bitching about nobody listening to you.
Even with all the bullshit the Court pulled, Bush ended up winning Florida by such a razor-thin margin that it would have only taken 0.5% of Nader’s Florida voters to tip the election to Gore.
Third-party voters gave the GOP the opportunity to steal the election.
You know what makes them win even fewer election? Allowing fucking Donald Trump to win the Presidency.
Vote dem in the general election, and change the party in the primaries. It’s literally the only path leftward in our system of government. Doing anything else moves the government further right.
Allowing fucking Donald Trump to win the Presidency
And you know who did that? You know who allowed that?
Democrats allowed that. They did it by blaming third parties before any votes were cast. They did that by blaming Muslim and Arab votes who didn’t want their friends and families to be bombed by US tax payers. They did that by telling voters they “had no other choice” when they clearly, clearly did.
If you are going to own this now obviously broken and defunct rhetoric it seems like you are committed to, then you own this loss.
If you can’t change your approach and recognize the changes that need to be made, you are the primary thing aiding and abetting fascism in this country, because Donald Trump could not have won without Democrats and their apologists online being committed to this now obviously failed strategy.
We’ve had a 2-party system for over 200 years. You aren’t changing that by believing super duper hard in a third option.
What you have to do is change the parties. Party direction isn’t set by losing general electionsm It’s set by choosing better candidates at the local level and in primary elections. Voting for a third party or choosing not to vote at all will never, ever move the country in the direction you want. It’s impossible.
The GOP is cancer, and right now the Democratic party is chemotherapy. It sucks, the side effects can feel worse than the disease, but it’s the best way to fight and survive.
Voting third party is going to a spirit healer. It’s playing make-believe and letting the cancer spread.
That was my first presidential election. Naive year 2000 me thought “Oh wow this is a huge obvious problem, and Australia already fixed it! It’ll be a part of the Democratic platform by 2004.”
To this day, I vote for any Democrat who supports ranked choice voting (or any clone-independent voting system).
In 2000 they 100% did and we’re still paying for that shit.
The problem isn’t that people voted for Jill Stein. The problem is not enough people voted for Jill Stein.
The left is so broken in this country that we can’t even get a candidate to 5%! And yet, we’re supposed to stop Trump?
You know what 5% of the electorate could do?
Ensure the GOP loses every general election and participate in primaries to move the Dems to the left.
That’s how you make change in our system. Not by throwing away votes.
People have been trying to move the Dems to the left for decades, and look at what we have now.
They’ve been trying by bitching about the party every couple years when the primaries they don’t participate in select the wrong candidates.
the dems haven’t had a primary since 2008
Primaries during incumbent sessions are never serious for any party, so 2012 doesn’t really count.
They had a very long primary process in 2016, but Hillary won. Yes, the establishment wanted her, but she also won more primaries than Bernie by the time the convention came around, so the super delegates deciding not to overturn the will of the primary voters is hard to argue against, even though I preferred Bernie.
2020 had a primary season, and Biden won.
2024, they had an incumbent, and Biden didn’t drop out until like 2 weeks before the convention.
And there were down-ballot races in the primaries endo one of those years and more. Did you vote in all of them, or are you just bitching because the people who do get off their ass and participate don’t do what you want?
you made an excuse for 2012, covered up the systemic corruption in 2016 and 2020, and made another excuse for 2024.
There were primaries every one of those years. There was no rigging of the primaries. If people had voted differently in them we’d had different candidates.
Once again, did you put in a minimal amount of effort to educate yourself on the candidates and participate, or did you just whine about it after the fact?
What about the other primary years when the important stuff is really decided? Biden, Obama, and Clinton didn’t just magically appear and become contenders to the Democratic primaries. They spent decades as party members, working their way up from the bottom. You think Bill Clinton would’ve been President if he hadn’t been Governor? You think he would’ve been Governor if he hadn’t been Attourney General? You think he wouldn’t have been Attourney General if he hadn’t previously run for the House?
There were primary elections every step of that path, and he won them all. That’s how he became Bill Clinton. And why did he win that first nomination?
He was a coordinator for the McGovern campaign and clerked for Senator Fullbright.
People don’t magically get nominated for the Presidency. It takes decades, and the people who will be nominees in the future are running for county clerk, state rep, or city council now. But if you only show up to vote in general elections every 2-4 years, or only vote in the Presidenial primaries, you don’t get to bitch about who gets selected because you wait 20 years to give your input on a candidate.
Take part in the process and give your input when and where it matters or stop bitching about nobody listening to you.
Not true, Gore won Florida in 2000 but it was stolen by the supreme Court in favor of Bush https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brooks_Brothers_riot
Even with all the bullshit the Court pulled, Bush ended up winning Florida by such a razor-thin margin that it would have only taken 0.5% of Nader’s Florida voters to tip the election to Gore.
Third-party voters gave the GOP the opportunity to steal the election.
But not the near majority of conservatives. The five hundred voters are entirely to blame.
Nader got nearly 97,421 votes in Florida. After the Supreme Court stopped the count, Bush won by 537 votes.
The environmentalist voters stopped Al fucking Gore from being President.
You need to self-examine and understand the wrong headeness of this kind of thinking.
No liberal or progressive will ever win another election if they adopt this mindset.
You know what makes them win even fewer election? Allowing fucking Donald Trump to win the Presidency.
Vote dem in the general election, and change the party in the primaries. It’s literally the only path leftward in our system of government. Doing anything else moves the government further right.
And you know who did that? You know who allowed that?
Democrats allowed that. They did it by blaming third parties before any votes were cast. They did that by blaming Muslim and Arab votes who didn’t want their friends and families to be bombed by US tax payers. They did that by telling voters they “had no other choice” when they clearly, clearly did.
If you are going to own this now obviously broken and defunct rhetoric it seems like you are committed to, then you own this loss.
If you can’t change your approach and recognize the changes that need to be made, you are the primary thing aiding and abetting fascism in this country, because Donald Trump could not have won without Democrats and their apologists online being committed to this now obviously failed strategy.
We’ve had a 2-party system for over 200 years. You aren’t changing that by believing super duper hard in a third option.
What you have to do is change the parties. Party direction isn’t set by losing general electionsm It’s set by choosing better candidates at the local level and in primary elections. Voting for a third party or choosing not to vote at all will never, ever move the country in the direction you want. It’s impossible.
The GOP is cancer, and right now the Democratic party is chemotherapy. It sucks, the side effects can feel worse than the disease, but it’s the best way to fight and survive.
Voting third party is going to a spirit healer. It’s playing make-believe and letting the cancer spread.
This is why the left keeps losing. We couldn’t unite behind Nader or Stein or any of our other candidates.
That was my first presidential election. Naive year 2000 me thought “Oh wow this is a huge obvious problem, and Australia already fixed it! It’ll be a part of the Democratic platform by 2004.”
To this day, I vote for any Democrat who supports ranked choice voting (or any clone-independent voting system).